Europa Cyprus - April 2007
Can you tell us about the British Museum's attempts to include "Ledra's Portrait" in its Cyprus Collection?
"Ledra's Portrait" is a reference to the Ledra crossing which geographically divided north and south Nicosia and where the political impact of the isolations was very strongly felt. "Ledra" is a portrait of a Cypriot woman drawn on Cypriot soil with paint made from a kind of raw amber soil special to Cyprus. I first covered the portrait with muslin, and then wrapped it with nylon. The breathing clay left water droplets on the nylon, giving the impression that Ledra was some place in between life and death. In time, like any living creature that is kept in a bell jar, it too found its inevitable end; the water and moisture within the soil, kept apart from the outside world for so long, just evaporated. The soil dried, cracked, and Ledra's face fell. The muslin ended up disintegrating and breaking up along with the earth. Ledra's beautiful face became totally unrecognizable.
Why do you think the British Museum wanted to include this piece in its Cyprus collection?
Probably because Ledra's portrait has become an archaeological artifact from Cyprus's recent history. Or because they see it as a work that represents the era of the isolations. Maybe as a reference to the symbols that played a role in the lifting of the isolations. I don't know exactly. We should ask the British Museum: Why do you want to include Ledra's Portrait in your Cypriot archeology collection? The British Museum's noteworthy gesture should serve as an example to other important European museums and galleries. Actually we should go and ask them: Do you also want Ledra's portrait?
After the problems with the Manifesta 6 European Biennial for Contemporary Art, the art world has become more interested in northern Cyprus. What do you think about this?
That Manifesta was not carried out as planned was not just a disappointment in itself; it was also a great loss for Cyprus and the art world. But the fact that this has resulted in the art world paying so much attention to North Cyprus should be celebrated, it's so wonderful. There isn't even one single private gallery to speak of in North Cyprus, but now work on the region's largest art center is moving at a furious pace here. There has been an explosion in the sales of art works. A piece of mud shaped by the President, Mr. Mehmet Ali Talat within the context of the "Raw Earth" project was sold for, and I am not exaggerating, 55,314.01 pounds, the value of an apartment. I'm very happy. Because this money covers the budget I needed to participate in this year's Venice Biennial, which it is absolutely necessary for me to attend.
Why is the Venice Biennial so important this year?
If I manage to participate in the 52nd Venice Biennial this year, outside of the official program, and totally independently, then there will be a total of four Cypriots coming from different geographies taking part in these 'art olympics'. This is a historic moment. Two years ago, Turkish Cypriot fashion designer/artists Hüseyin Çaglayan represented the Turkish Republic for the first time. In this year's Biennial, England will be represented by Tracey Emin, who is of Turkish Cypriot origin. South Cyprus or the Republic of Cyprus, through the art exhibition titled "Old Earth, no more lies, I've seen you" will be represented by Haris Epaminonda and Mustafa Hulusi. The 52nd Venice Biennial is creating a very special artistic situation for Cyprus. Especially for Turkish Cypriots. That three of the four Cypriots are Turkish Cypriots is a very nice feeling.
When you say that Manifesta 6 was not carried out as planned, do you also mean to say that it did in fact take place?
Of course Manifesta 6 took place. Not as planned, but it did take place. Otherwise you would not be interviewing me as "Toprak". A new formula for solving the Cyprus problem was even found.
2+2=
˘ I'm sure you've seen it. On the last day of the Manifesta 6 School, nearly all newspapers in Cyprus made this the front page news.
How did 'Toprak' come to life?
I was first born in Cyprus in a human form named Ül-man. In 1977 when I was studying in Istanbul, three bullets went through my head, and I was reborn. After this, in England I became Summer. In 1998 I wanted to be reborn again in Cyprus. To find the path of love I killed Summer in Lefkosa's AKM hall. In 2000 I tried to use collective spirit in order to be reborn in the Besparmak Mountains, but I couldn't die. And finally I killed myself at Manifesta 6's Coffee Break. To be born as TOPRAK (Earth). And I was BORN.
What is the meaning of all these deaths, all these rebirths?
You cannot die before being born in a physical sense. In spiritual terms, you cannot be reborn without dying first. As such, these terms are all part of the same whole. Ül-man represents the body; Summer, the mind; and Toprak, the spirit.
Is it true that you organized an operation at the North Cyprus parliament?
That is what Kibris newspaper wrote. At the Parliament, I took a piece from each of the bodies of several MPs and other people who work there, and added some soil to it. Then, I gave it back to them with a text that said "this very valuable piece of earth is being given to you temporarily, I may require it back" along with a stamped title deed. Probably in the near future I will go and ask for my land back, land which I gave to them with a title deed but only provisionally. We'll see what happens.
Is it true that you undressed and held mass at the Haydarpasa Mosque?
That's true. Before anything else, that space used to be a mosque. Now it is an art gallery. Before that it was St. Caterine's Cathedral. It is the world's most mystical location. Mother Mary wet me with her breath there. And I realized my project, "The Work of God" there, with soil, water, fire and breath. While opening my insides, I broke open my surfaces. That's the essence of it.
How did "Raw Earth," which was intended for Manifesta 6, develop?
The project began with the occupation of an abandoned Turkish house in the village of Templos. A pool was made where the flooring had collapsed on the first floor of the house, in the guest room. Just when the work was about to be completed, because access to the waterless pool from the front entrance was denied by the owners of the house, it became necessary to build a wooden bridge at the back of the house. Then another bridge, made out of metal, was installed at the Lokmaci Barricade in Lefkosa. To make sure that there was a relationship between the two bridges, the Lokmaci Bridge stairs were painted in the same colors as the house's windows.
Why was the pool with no water made?
Yes, I did not fill the pool that one approached with the wooden bridge. Because the pool was made neither for breeding fish, nor for swimming. The pool had a spiritual function. I made the pool to cleanse my soul. And in that pool I made love to an angel. People do not need water to cleanse their souls. They need love.
But to cleanse my body I had to embark on a more difficult adventure. I made a long journey from Cyprus carrying 200 grams of soil. My first stop was Istanbul. Then London. Then the island of Ibiza. In a sailboat, together with the soil I brought from Cyprus, I crossed the Straits of Gibraltar and arrived in England. At the gravel shores of Brighton, I melted the soil of Cyprus like soap over my body and washed myself. I washed my filth into the ocean.
You cleansed your soul. You cleansed your body. Did you cleanse your knowledge?
Of course I cleansed it. This is perhaps the most tragic of all. And I named it "Catharsis". First I spat in my palm. Then I mixed my spit with earth which I smeared all over my face. Then I tried to cleanse my knowledge by spreading around words indiscriminately. I threw up. I'm sure they were saying, "Who is this crazy person?" And in this way, before the eyes of the art world, at the Arabahmet Cultural Center, during the coffee brakes of Manifesta 6 School, with the aim of being reborn as Toprak, I succeeded in killing myself.
Why have you done all of this?
The line between reality and fiction, art and life, is very fine. I think that this is my problem. Unfortunately, I am unable to separate fiction from reality, art from life. This is very hard. I can't even determine if what I do is art or not. Can you make that distinction?